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Autor Thema: The dustmen take to space!  (Gelesen 3857 mal)

Shadowcaster

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The dustmen take to space!
« am: 15. Februar 2008, 16:39:35 »
Hier aus Auszug aus den neuesten Devblog. Und ich kann zu dem Thema nur sagen: Endlich!

---
Hey everyone! This is Prism X, EVE's database developer, with his first ever Dev Blog. I do not get to do many of these as most of my job revolves around the things behind the scenes, but I reckon there might be a second one someday. As CCP grows in size more and more people with database experience are drafted into our ranks and my focus thus shifts elsewhere where it is required. Currently it is shifting towards announcing one of the features in the upcoming Trinity 1.1 update. The cleanup of space-junk!

The How
The functionality itself depends on the type of space junk in question.

Generic Junk
The following item groups are defined as generic junk: Drones, Fighters, Shuttles and Rookie Ships. Generic space junk will be removed (Read: permanently deleted) from open space the first of every month. As generic junk of this kind has been purposely left floating in space for logistical reasons there is an exception to this rule. See below.

Anchorable Containers
Anchorable containers will from now on have a 30 day lifetime from last usage. This means that once you anchor a container it will gain an "Expires In:" attribute. If this container enters downtime with 0 days left it will be removed from space. Last usage is either when it was last anchored or opened. This means that as long as you take care of your space cache every month, it will be safe. However, if you leave an unanchored container it will be removed immediately the next down time. The same exception applies to anchorable containers as to generic junk (see below).

Example
Here we can see an unanchored giant container and a recently anchored small one.

The Starbase Factor
To avoid disrupting logistics as much as possible, we decided to give Starbases a protective field from all Fedos, Dustmen and other factors which might remove your stuff. This means that both generic junk as well as the anchorable containers will not be removed if left in close proximity to Starbases. This is regardless of who owns the item, but keep in mind that leaving things outside enemy Starbases is probably not a good way to safeguard them and their content. This setup should allow for most heavily used item caches to remain useful, hidden caches will have to be maintained and abandoned caches will leave the game freeing up resources for us all.

The Why
Ever since we announced the Need For Speed (NFS) initiative we've been searching every nook and cranny for refactoring possibilities. However, it's not just about the refactoring of old features but also a frame of mind when coding the new features or, as in this case, it can be the driving factors behind the feature itself. We are all quite aware of all that space junk which never seems to go away. Granted, it's never a cache of Fighters we stumble across but who doesn't remember that anchored container in their old high-sec home? Yeah, the one that read "Prism X cna has Chezeeburgers!! ... Plz send ISK!" or something similarly witty. Remember how annoying you found it?

Not surprisingly, it turns out to be more than just an annoyance. I don't want to go into too many details (though I know some of you want me to) but it is common knowledge that upon entering any system you preload all (non-sensitive) information needed about the system from the node it's on. As this is frequently queried information the node caches - in pre-cache or on-demand cache depending on information - all this information so it does not need to query the live DB repeatedly for the same information.

So you jump into a system, during the session change all the information you need is transmitted to you from the SOL nodes different caches. This may include refreshing some parts of the caches from the live database as they may have been invalidated or flushed to make room for new, possibly more frequently used, items. Currently, all is well in space as you are the only living entity in this over-simplified example and every solar system you visit has a dedicated node. (Side note: In this example caching is more for 're-load' than 'pre-load' purposes).

Now, if we move back to reality and look at the actual scale of things and accept uncomfortable things such as limitations, things pan out a bit differently. You are now a part of approximately 30K players constantly moving between systems, and nodes, thus demanding new set of system information with every jump. Due to resource limitations we have many systems on one SOL node and only limited cache sizes for all the different caching services. Caches now get invalidated more frequently (Note: not all do, but due to limitations the less mission critical ones must) with more players requesting information from larger datasets.

Now let's imagine what happens to this information transfer if one system alone on the SOL node were to contain more cargo container information than can exist in the container cache at any given time (Note: this is simplification again. The nature of caching mechanisms is that you can never cache everything so this does apply in a more complex sense.). This means that whenever someone jumps into that system each and every cached cargo container on every other system on the node is invalidated to make room for the new info. Furthermore the system cannot cache in all the information in one go and, depending on implementation of the caching service, this can mean a whole bundle of redundant I/O's.

Now imagine all those containers are somebody's forgotten containers and they are causing your session changes to last longer, our database to be queried more frequently, more data to go over the wire etc. For no good reason, nobody is using them! This is the NFS initiative in a nutshell. With this implemented we're effectively increasing the container cache efficiency rather than just its capacity. Naturally increasing the capacity is not out of the question but the gain from a capacity increase is proportional to its efficiency.
Hence: The Space Junk must die!

The When
Like I mentioned earlier this is to be implemented in Trinity 1.1.
In the future we might tweak the expiry time on anchored containers, and depending on performance gain we might schedule the junk cleanup more frequently than once per month. Perhaps some sort of monthly anchoring charge would be in order. Nothing further is set in stone though. Nothing other than: The Space Junk must die!

DevBlog: The dustmen take to space!


Grmlz

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #1 am: 15. Februar 2008, 16:46:24 »
Klingt gut.

                                                   :Austria:
                      

Baumstumpf

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #2 am: 15. Februar 2008, 17:21:15 »
hmm, wußte garnicht das die sachen so lange im raum bleiben. da bin ich schon fast versucht 5000 rookieschiffe an der hauptstation in jita zu platzieren *fg*

Itchy

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #3 am: 16. Februar 2008, 18:45:20 »
Oh ja, endlich.

Espoir

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #4 am: 17. Februar 2008, 16:35:53 »
Jo wenns was bringt bestimmt ne gute Sache. Dürfte auch Jita gut helfen und die nervige Corp-Werbung an Gates.

Nur solche RP-Sachen wie das Erreichen von EVE in New Eden (per Conti Reihe) oder diese riesige Grabstätte werden dadurch natürlich behindert. Aber vielleicht wird es auch da Sonderregelungen geben.

Grmlz

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #5 am: 17. Februar 2008, 17:07:03 »
Was isn in new eden?
Ich war da noch nie^^

                                                   :Austria:
                      

Espoir

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #6 am: 17. Februar 2008, 17:48:23 »
Hier steht etwas:
http://www.eveger.de/forum/archive/index.php/t-6691.html

Ansonsten weiß ich auch nich so genau. Neben New Eden Planet 1 (also dem ersten besiedelten Planeten) soll es eine große Anomalie geben (sieht auch so aus wie eine Sonne) - DAS Wurmloch. Und man versucht mit Contis eine Kette zu bilden in diese Anomalie rein. Sind halt noch einige Mio KM. Irgendwie so :)

Sogar noch aktuell der Thread:
http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=373791&page=3

Ist natürlich nicht ganz einfach zum letzten Conti zu kommen wenn nicht alle ihr BMs ablegen etc

Shadowcaster

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #7 am: 17. Februar 2008, 17:57:26 »
Nur solche RP-Sachen wie das Erreichen von EVE in New Eden (per Conti Reihe) oder diese riesige Grabstätte werden dadurch natürlich behindert. Aber vielleicht wird es auch da Sonderregelungen geben.

Einfach mit in den Thread schreiben um z.B. New Eden zu erhalten.

Hier ist übrigens ne Antwort zu dem Thema:

Zitat von: CCP Prism X
Hey guys. Just want to show that I'm still reading this and talk a bit more about the graveyard which is an issue to you and myself.

I'll be in your face and honest like I always am but I'll make room for a sentence explaining it because I don't feel totally right saying this. The graveyard, in it's current form, is dead. I'll just admit it here and now that I will not listen to any reasons as to why that shouldn't happen. I'm certain a whole lot of you think that is very irresponsible of me as you're the community and customers but you have to understand me on this: "I cannot grant exceptions. I cannot favour one party over the other. Hence I will not."

I'm pleading with you here. I feel like fecal matter for destroying player driven content in it's current form. I could give very detailed technical reasons for why it has to happen but it wouldn't do anyone any favours. I feel like utter crap for destroying the work Azia put into this. I feel like utter crap for assuming the position of 'the man'. The governing body who's saying "It's my way or the highway!". Your points, that I'm ruining persistence of player driven content: It's right. I feel bad. But I cannot make exceptions. I cannot favour one endavour over the other. Ever.

Just to iterate: I wont favour any one person, or her activities, over any other.

I don't say I'm sorry. I never have. I hardly admit that I'm wrong when I obviously am. But I'm truly sorry about this. I should have put a blatant stop to this in the original thread. At least made some contigencies for me to fall back on here, but I didn't. I should have ensured that a feature I knew I'd be scrapping come the first opportunity would not have been highlighted to the players by lore. I should have done many things differently and now I'm in the situation that I have to ruin one persons work to do what I'm payed for. And I don't like it one bit.

And to soothe my pain I'll go out on a limb here. I'll do my best to assist Azia in any way possible. At least to relocate the containers. I have *no* authority to say this and I will have to check with my superiors and coworkers before I can do anything. But I would like to open discussions to a solution which does not include abusing the caching services which will negatively affect a lot of other players in neighbouring solarsystems.

But please. Stop asking for things I can't morally live up to. Please.

~ Prism X
EvE Database Developer
Relocating your character to a cozy, secure container since 2006

[Quelle: MyEve]


Espoir

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Re: The dustmen take to space!
« Antwort #8 am: 17. Februar 2008, 18:14:41 »
Ah danke. Werde mein /signed drunter setzen. Wollte schon immer mal nach New Eden. Einfach so. Ist ja eigentlich der einzige Platz in EVE der was besonderes bietet (bzgl dieser Art content),

 

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